Great one, Mr. Pesca! When you look at all of this through the lens of comedy and then, separately, as Shakespearean drama, It's Et Tu Brute "All The Way Down", yeah?
The subtitle of the piece is a lyric from that Hold Steady song. Berryman’s inclusion among a group of poets who drowned was also included in August: Osage County. I was not aware that he actually landed on the knoll. Thanks for bringing it to my attention.
But I was curious about this list of drowned poets in August: Osage County, and it just took a second to get an ebook of the play's script from my public library. And...I don't see it stating anywhere that Berryman or any real-life poet died of drowning. It refers to Berryman and one other poet (Hart Crane) being the kind of people who would jump off the nearest bridge if they'd had a wife like T.S. Elliot had, but it doesn't say anything about water or drowning. This screen capture includes every time the name "Berryman" appears in the e-book script: https://imgur.com/a/prrWfeP
I've not seen the film version of the play (and I really should get back to the work I'm paid for rather than watch it now). Is this list of drowned poets maybe only in the movie?
Similar to what may have happened in Succession, it could be that the playwright thought Berryman committed suicide by drowning (even though the play never explicitly says that he did), and/or that the character Beverly is supposed to have thought that. The allusion to Berryman's suicide must be meant to foreshadow Beverly's own death later in Act I, and Beverly does die of drowning.
Also, as long as I'm teetering on the brink of pedantry I might as well go all the way and say, don't you think you should correct this sentence, since it's not true?: "Drowning was the [sic.] John Berryman’s means of suicide, specifically climbing onto a railing and keeling into a river flowing through an American metropolis." Drowning was not his means of suicide and he never keeled into a river. There's apparently some confusion in the culture over this, and even if it's a very small point in the scheme of things, isn't it better not to contribute to that confusion?
As a proud Minneapolitan myself, I'll accept your flattering reference to our city as a "metropolis," and I guess it does actually meet the (very lax) technical definition: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metropolis#United_States
The August Osage county reference was that one you mentioned. It was a reference to two poets who drowned in the context of the character Bev who winds up drowning. I assume it was bc alerts, like me, he jumped off the bridge into the Mississippi River.
But John Berryman didn't drown. He jumped from the part of the bridge that is over the ground and must have deliberately done so. He was never in the water and never meant to be. See page 501 of the Berryman biography by Paul Mariani, at https://imgur.com/P7pXZ0i
So it's not a perfect parallel between Kendall and Berryman's actual means of death, though it may be a parallel between Kendall and the popular but incorrect understanding of how Berryman died. Apparently there's a song by The Hold Steady that refers to him drowning. Maybe the show's writers were similarly misinformed. (I also posted about this on The Gist's Subreddit after Mike talked about it in yesterday's Spiel.)
Great show, each character was amazing. Everyone is an egomaniac. The Roy kids all believed they were the ones to take over, but they were all just entitled, including Connor who thought he could be President. Romans line "we are all bullshit" was the best. Each one believed their own shit.
"Succession never cared about how the world might splinter apart due to the carelessness of the Roys."
Jesse Armstrong created a great show, and we can only respect his decision to do it the way he did it--but I often wondered about how the show would have have looked if it gave us more than glimpses of the damage the Roys did to the country. (Assuming that the Roys were at all comparable to the Murdochs.) It seems to me that they flirted with this in the last few episodes, when each of the siblings place personal gain over the fate of the country, but this was only a brief and mild flirtation.
Great one, Mr. Pesca! When you look at all of this through the lens of comedy and then, separately, as Shakespearean drama, It's Et Tu Brute "All The Way Down", yeah?
This and the Sopranos are the two greatest dramas and 2 of the top comedies as well.
The subtitle of the piece is a lyric from that Hold Steady song. Berryman’s inclusion among a group of poets who drowned was also included in August: Osage County. I was not aware that he actually landed on the knoll. Thanks for bringing it to my attention.
I'm really not trying to be a pedant, I swear.
But I was curious about this list of drowned poets in August: Osage County, and it just took a second to get an ebook of the play's script from my public library. And...I don't see it stating anywhere that Berryman or any real-life poet died of drowning. It refers to Berryman and one other poet (Hart Crane) being the kind of people who would jump off the nearest bridge if they'd had a wife like T.S. Elliot had, but it doesn't say anything about water or drowning. This screen capture includes every time the name "Berryman" appears in the e-book script: https://imgur.com/a/prrWfeP
I've not seen the film version of the play (and I really should get back to the work I'm paid for rather than watch it now). Is this list of drowned poets maybe only in the movie?
Similar to what may have happened in Succession, it could be that the playwright thought Berryman committed suicide by drowning (even though the play never explicitly says that he did), and/or that the character Beverly is supposed to have thought that. The allusion to Berryman's suicide must be meant to foreshadow Beverly's own death later in Act I, and Beverly does die of drowning.
Also, as long as I'm teetering on the brink of pedantry I might as well go all the way and say, don't you think you should correct this sentence, since it's not true?: "Drowning was the [sic.] John Berryman’s means of suicide, specifically climbing onto a railing and keeling into a river flowing through an American metropolis." Drowning was not his means of suicide and he never keeled into a river. There's apparently some confusion in the culture over this, and even if it's a very small point in the scheme of things, isn't it better not to contribute to that confusion?
As a proud Minneapolitan myself, I'll accept your flattering reference to our city as a "metropolis," and I guess it does actually meet the (very lax) technical definition: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metropolis#United_States
The August Osage county reference was that one you mentioned. It was a reference to two poets who drowned in the context of the character Bev who winds up drowning. I assume it was bc alerts, like me, he jumped off the bridge into the Mississippi River.
But John Berryman didn't drown. He jumped from the part of the bridge that is over the ground and must have deliberately done so. He was never in the water and never meant to be. See page 501 of the Berryman biography by Paul Mariani, at https://imgur.com/P7pXZ0i
So it's not a perfect parallel between Kendall and Berryman's actual means of death, though it may be a parallel between Kendall and the popular but incorrect understanding of how Berryman died. Apparently there's a song by The Hold Steady that refers to him drowning. Maybe the show's writers were similarly misinformed. (I also posted about this on The Gist's Subreddit after Mike talked about it in yesterday's Spiel.)
Why did you feel the need to send an email with "Did Kendall Drown" in the subject line? Needlessly douchey spoiler, dude.
Great show, each character was amazing. Everyone is an egomaniac. The Roy kids all believed they were the ones to take over, but they were all just entitled, including Connor who thought he could be President. Romans line "we are all bullshit" was the best. Each one believed their own shit.
I will miss it. Fit for a King!
"Succession never cared about how the world might splinter apart due to the carelessness of the Roys."
Jesse Armstrong created a great show, and we can only respect his decision to do it the way he did it--but I often wondered about how the show would have have looked if it gave us more than glimpses of the damage the Roys did to the country. (Assuming that the Roys were at all comparable to the Murdochs.) It seems to me that they flirted with this in the last few episodes, when each of the siblings place personal gain over the fate of the country, but this was only a brief and mild flirtation.
A flirt. A hint. Yes something of a brief nod to it, but it’s not where the show wanted to live.